Making Progress?
The following video is a discussion between Father Thomas Keating, O.C.S.O., and Ken Wilbur, of Integral Institute, on aspects of contemplation and contemplative prayer, particularly in terms of the false self and spiritual stages. Note, at approximately 6 minutes into the video, the little gasps and murmurs from the audience as they recognize the truth of what Father Keating has just said: “And that’s why, to take a determination not to contribute to the messiness of the world by adding our own false-self projects to it, is one of the greatest gifts you could give to humanity.”
Father Keating also speaks of the Great Commandment, and on the subject of loving the Lord our God with our whole mind, heart, soul and with all of our strength, he says: “…it is impossible to do without contemplative prayer and the insight that that brings.”
At approximately seven-and-a-half minutes into the video, Ken Wilbur describes the stages of growth and development that men and women tend to go through spiritually, and how these stages (of nearness to the Divine presence) can now be “measured” scientifically, at least “on the psychological side of the street”. He is very sincere and excited about this, because, as he sees it, this scientific data can now be used in arguments about the effectiveness of contemplative prayer - the measurable results can counter non-believers’ statements that the whole thing is merely “wishful thinking”.
Yet Father Keating brings the discussion back to the spiritual reality of the hardships and difficulties facing those who follow the contemplative path, and of the necessity of growth in humility. Notice how he does this gently, with an exquisite sense of humour.
And remember - if you are growing in your contemplative practice and in humility, and find your life unmanageable as you’re living it, take heart in one of Father Keating’s final remarks, that “this is a triumph, not a disaster.”
Direct to YouTube for this video is here.
I look so forward to seeing this, and will do so later when I am inspectionally-carless for the eve, after soup kitchen and then supper, but I wanted to say that last night while Googling the phrase “The temptation of Christ” (and as always finding too much of what I wasn’t looking for), there was a terrific musing on it by Fr. Keating. Because of some unfamiliar-to-me concepts, I didn’t orthodoxly post it anywhere, but it’s worth pointing to nonetheless. Very much so. Anyway, aDieu for now.
February 12th, 2008 at 3:37 pmps.. your heading cracked me up, ’cause I still measure my progress by the lightning bolts out of the sky, or the merciful lack thereof. But thank you for this find. We’re really going to like it a lot, aren’t we?
February 12th, 2008 at 3:41 pmWell, I’m hoping anyone watching/listening will not have any knee-jerk reations to the first five minutes or so, because it is the meat of the discussion after that point that I really posted this for at the moment. In Fr.’s opening remarks he talks about faith preceding belief systems, and some may have trouble accepting/understanding what he is saying without getting their feathers ruffled. We should keep in mind his years of inter-religious work, and also the fact that what he is saying is true; of course direct experience of the Divine preceded faith systems; we know that people had direct, mystical experience of the Divine before the Incarnation of Christ our Lord, for example, i.e., before the establishment of Christianity, and that’s what he’s getting at in the first few minutes.
Progress measured by lightning bolts or the merciless lack thereof. Ow. He generally only bats me over the head, then hands me a Tylenol.
February 12th, 2008 at 5:53 pmWhat I get from it is that we must recognize the false self (we always settle too easily for what others deemed us over the years, rather than remaining the soul who communed with God more closely/easily as a child), and courageously begin to contemplate Him, and via humility, we can and ought to harness our contemplation for the right reason - to allow God to come through to us more clearly, that we truly live His life, but also so that we might truly come to know Him more deeply..that we do stop at a certain level.
One thing that came to me all through this, and his comment about not needing the inconvenience of alchoholism, is the working of the 12 Steps of AA. It doesn’t matter whether someone is addicted to substance, or to a certain way of thinking that has proven not helpful, working the steps (our parish priest led us in many discussion series with the workbook format help of “12 Steps in the Bible” and the following year’s exercises which are far more intense “12 Steps of Spirituality.” He gave us these in response to the Bishop’s call for the laity to adhere more and get busier with Second Vatican Council’s “Evangelization in the Modern World.” If we ourselves didn’t believe in God’s unconditional love and weren’t functioning on that, there was not much hope of evangelizing our God to others, but rather only our take on our belief in Him via our belief system.
He doesn’t say this, but we owe it Him to come closer any way we can. And He would nod and say, “You owe it to yourselves and those around you, too.” All I can say is, where would we be without the monastic?
February 12th, 2008 at 9:57 pmOh gosh, sorry - I made such a mishmash of that comment. Tired. The point about the AA step-working was the necessity of clearing out the baggage, first. We need a clear path between us and God, whether for His healing or for His infused prayer (contemplation). And I meant to clarify, as he does, that in contemplation, we aren’t for a moment divorcing it from our belief system, (i.e., Catholicism) we just follow it upward more. I never think about these things anymore; it’s nice to be reminded that He is waiting for more, if we can sit down and open to it.
February 12th, 2008 at 10:09 pmIn my case faith proceeding belief systems is how it happened. I had been away from the Church my whole adult life to that point. Over 20 years, and most of it as a hard agnostic. A series of events led me to consider faith as a mature adult. One day I woke up, “there is a God.” Poof I had a faith. At first I thought eastern religion, but thought better. Then for a few weeks a protestant church. Then I realized that I had to start from the beginning. I was baptized, confession, and communion in the Church. So I returned.
What aided my transition from non-believer to Roman Catholic was Fr. Keating. I like very much what he says at that end. To me it is an indirect reference to detachment.
February 13th, 2008 at 12:17 amWow!!! Pretty profound…I do need help when it comes to contemplative prayer. Looking inward is hard for me…I can focus on the “others” in my prayer life…but there are times when I don’t want to look “inside” me. This was a great eye opener. I’m not a complete “disaster” I’m a work in progress….and so on and so on and so on…..
And because of this wonderful inspirational site and all it has to offer me, I have something for you, if you will just drop by at your convenience. Good Evening and God Bless.
February 13th, 2008 at 6:03 pmOne of the things that bothers me about contemplative prayer is that I’m coming to it from between a Rock and a hard place. Literally. I need to see the bridge between a well-ingrained “be good for God!” (with its attendant “thunderbolts” if not), and the “God wants you to come up even closer.” (My reaction to that is, Me?? In times when I am able to keep myself from sinning, I’m not able to keep loved ones from doing so. And even now, I’m looking at Valentines I did not send out until tomorrow. AND I missed Mass. At NOON. Surely contemplative prayer is for the more advanced, saintly, or even those in more control, etc., etc.)
But I think the bridge is this– and it is attested to by Church-honored saints: He desires the closeness. It’s not about me, it’s about Him, eh? It behooves us to give that to Him in this way, for that is really what all the “Be good for God!” is about, ultimately. The Baltimore Catechism said it differently, but it said it: God desires our greater closeness.
And with the greater closeness, shall come the more in control, if not eventually saintly. I’d give Him a greater closeness, at least, yes. I must buckle down to this, too.
February 14th, 2008 at 1:03 pmIs Fr Keating totally orthodox..i thought he strayed into buddhist type meditations but correct me if i’m wrong..
February 17th, 2008 at 6:07 amJustMe, one of the points he’s making here, re one of the effects of contemplative prayer being the release of these early traumas/defenses, etc., was very helpful to me early on. It was very encouraging to gain some knowledge of the psychological effects as well as the spiritual effects of contemplative prayer. Knowing that we may feel that things are getting worse instead of better, but that that is indeed a good sign, a sign that the healing is beginning, gives one the courage to continue - and although I don’t know anything really about the 12-step programs, I think it is as you say - a similar process of unearthing the baggage so it can be let go of, rather than repressed/ignored. The bridge between the Commandments and union? Love.
JohnT, that is very interesting that it was Fr. Keating who aided you in your transition. I know I was very grateful to find some of his early works, because they helped me to understand some of the psychological aspects of contemplative prayer, but this was some time after I had already read St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross.
Cathy, well, I understand what you’re saying regarding the amount of time we focus on others with intercessory prayer, and that it is all too easy to neglect our own prayer time with the Lord. But contemplative prayer is not a gazing inward, it is gazing at the Lord. It is usually a practice of sitting in silence, for at least twenty minutes a day for beginners, in a state of active receptivity, active waiting, for whatever the Lord may wish to give you. He may draw you into contemplation, He may not, but the practice alone will begin a process of healing, as Fr. Keating describes.
Jackie, totally orthodox? No, he’s not.
But I wonder if orthodox is a word we often even hear in relation to contemplatives and/or mystics. I know the biggest outcry against him is regarding centering prayer, but it would take such a long time and so many posts for me to express my viewpoint on the whole debate, I think it will not be right now, because I need to concentrate on other things. But I know for a fact that he has greatly aided in keeping many people in the Catholic Church instead of them wandering off to the Eastern religions, thinking that the Catholic Church had nothing to offer them in terms of contemplative practice simply because they did not know their Catholic heritage along these lines. And I also know how instrumental he was in bringing Lectio Divina back into the daily practice of so many Catholics. But no matter what anybody says on either side of the debate, I present certain things here only in the hope that they will be helpful in some way; I rely on my readers to do their own research as well, to use their discernment, and I pray not to ever lead anyone astray.
February 17th, 2008 at 6:57 pmI was thinking about Jackie’s question the other day, and wondered if anyone could say that Jesus Himself was very orthodox in any way, once the last leg of His mission began.
February 17th, 2008 at 9:11 pmI was thinking of that too, Carol, and it got me to thinking about freedom, this freedom that Fr. Keating speaks of, that Thomas Merton spoke of, that St. Augustine famously spoke of. When one is in union with the Divine this freedom comes into existence, this transcendence of the law, because only Love is at work; and isn’t that really what the whole of the New Testament is all about.
February 17th, 2008 at 10:54 pmYes.
February 22nd, 2008 at 10:32 pm