Contemplative Haven

Oct 19 2007

The Language of Divine Love

17 responses so far

17 Responses to “The Language of Divine Love”

1. # Annon 19 Oct 2007 at 12:25 pm

   Gabrielle, I haven’t listened to the recording yet but reading what you’re saying here reminds me of how surprised I was when I first encountered the intimacy of the language in the poetry of St John of the Cross. In fact I remember thinking it was courageously written, and obviously expressive of great love.
   I think too we humans are limited by words, no matter how beautifully put together they might be, for none can adequately describe a beauty that is indescribable and a union that is mystical. Though when we do hear a song that touches our hearts we can easily identify with the feelings that someone has articulated because they resonate with something deep within ourselves that seldom rises to the surface in such a way as can be shared. And that’s what you’re doing here.
2. # JustMeon 19 Oct 2007 at 1:10 pm

   There have been many mystical saints, but few have been declared a Doctor of the Church, a distinction which isTeresa of Avila’s. (She is one of only three women in all the history of the Church to be declared Doctor.) That is something which cannot validly be argued in any way, for which we and she are not only grateful, but which indicates with full sureness that we may dare move forward on this same path toward greater closeness with the One who has Said nothing into this created world of created men, for all of humankind’s life, except, “Come to Me!”

   I’ve often measured my involvement with unusual prayer/action with how I might explain this or that to my Mere Mere. I am afraid she would be scandalized on behalf of God (and Mary and all the saints) by the song, and would think me confused indeed–much as was my reaction long ago to John Michael Talbot’s first book in which he used the language of a woman in love. I think I blushed, and was incredibly confused. And that was but a precursor to my bafflement in reading a latter day enclosed Carmelite’s writings. I gave that book away, lest God see it in my hands.

   Yet, there is something which cannot be denied..(and it doesn’t do away with the unseen coat of mail of Confirmation– and it sure as heck doesn’t do away with suffering).

   In the final analysis, there are Moments that cannot be explained– least of all to the most pristine, loyal, devout suffering grandma; in lieu of her sure blessing upon this path, one might simply accept the Church’s sure blessing instead.
3. # Annon 19 Oct 2007 at 4:58 pm

   Gabrielle, I listened to the recording and i looked up some of Rumi’s poetry. I’ve copied this one not only because it is short but primarily because there’s something generous and promising and love- filled about it – it can only be God and His wonderful merciful heart.

   Come, come, whoever you are

   Wonderer, worshipper, lover of leaving.
   It doesn’t matter.
   Ours is not a caravan of despair.
   Come, even if you have broken your vow

   a thousand times
   Come, yet again, come, come.
4. # gabrielleon 19 Oct 2007 at 6:19 pm

   Ann, it’s true that we are very limited by language, but thank goodness that doesn’t stop poets like yourself, and musicians, from emptying out their hearts and souls for us. St. John of the Cross, Teresa of Avila and others were indeed very courageous, as is mentioned in the video, especially during the Inquisition. Not only courageous in revealing the depths of their love, but doing so in those dangerous years.

   The Rumi poem you’ve shared here is lovely, Ann. It speaks to me too, of Divine Mercy. My friend Kristin who sometimes comments here loves the poetry of Rumi as well and sent me some YouTube links. I had a couple of my own favourites as well, which I was planning to put on my Mystics Page, and maybe I can find some time to do that this weekend.

   JustMe, you raise a very good point though, in that we should be careful of what we are reading, who we are reading, etc., and when in doubt, don’t be shy to check out the author and the subject-matter with a knowledgeable person. Yes, Teresa of Avila was a Dr. of the Church, as was St. Catherine of Siena and St. Therese de Lisieux – and to top it off, Teresa of Avila was a Dr. of the Church in the area of “Prayer”.

   I don’t know whether or not you watched the video yet, JustMe, but if you didn’t, it’s very intuitive that you mentioned John Michael Talbot, because when I first watched the video I thought of him, as one in a long, long line of troubador poets.
5. # terryon 19 Oct 2007 at 10:32 pm

   I reflect often on the fact that, at the end of his life, after he had stated that all his writings he now considered as “so much straw,” Thomas Aquinas was immersed in the Song of Songs.

   At the end, this brilliant philosopher and theologian found the most relevant language to reflect on his God in the most intimate book of the Bible.
6. # JustMeon 19 Oct 2007 at 11:31 pm

   Indeed, Terry, and indeed, G — I watched the video and smiled as I heard the word “troubador”.. and indeed, that is a beautiful poem above.
7. # JustMeon 20 Oct 2007 at 9:36 am

   “My King, I beseech You, that all to whom I speak become mad from Your love….This soul would now want to see itself free – eating kills it; sleeping distresses it…nothing other than You can give it pleasure any longer…and I would desire to see no other persons than those who are sick with this sickness I now have.”

   I wonder if that is how Paul felt when he said, “To live is Christ; to die is but gain”?
8. # teresaon 20 Oct 2007 at 10:15 am

   I am learning that if I am more open and LISTEN to other religions and spiritualities, there is that common thread of the Love of God. There was so much close-minded-ness in my youth due to strict religious training. Spiritual maturity has taken on a new meaning for me in my late middle age. I believe the reason for that barrier was a fear that came with the whole package..
   How beautiful this video you have posted here, Gab. The Biblical Song of Songs goes hand in hand with what he is saying of the poetry.
   As for the ‘Experience’ of the Love of God (which is very real in the lives of contemplatives today), I find that there is an interpretation (really a misinterpretation)of St John that says…’if I feel absolutely nothing in my prayer and it is as dry as a bone, then I am spiritually mature’. In other words, ..if the experience of the Love of God is not part of the prayer, the pray-er must be advanced, and experiencing something means immaturity’. How wrong! St John’s poetry is BASED on his experience of that very Love in his prayer life.
   What is the sign of maturity? Not experiences(although I’ll take whatever God blesses me with)
   And not dryness .
   The criteria are the VIRTUES at work every day in my life.
   Just some thoughts I have been pondering for the past few weeks that go directly with what you have blessed me with today here in this post, Gab.
   teresa_anawim
9. # gabrielleon 20 Oct 2007 at 1:01 pm

   Terry, I had no idea – thanks so much for sharing that reflection re St. Thomas Aquinas. It makes me wonder a little what he would have produced in terms of love poetry if it had happened to him some years before he was on his deathbed. I think of John of the Cross’ Burning Flame of Love and the Spiritual Canticles, and Teresa’s meditations on the Song of Songs.

   JustMe, I think it is very much along the same lines, that burning desire for complete union with God that often makes the physical necessities of life seem so tedious, at least for a period of time along the path.

   teresa, I agree with everything you’ve said. For me it is an impossibility not to see, feel and hear the Love of God in the Sufi, Hindu and Jewish mystical traditions for example – what can it be, other than the work of the Holy Spirit? And yes, love and the virtues I would also agree are the criteria, the indications, not consolations or dryness, which vary from individual to individual, as well as varying greatly throughout one individual’s life.
10. # Piaon 20 Oct 2007 at 1:53 pm

    I watched the video and I was mesmerized by it. I was reminded of St. Francis of Assisi, and his Canticle of Creatures. The speaker mentions a persian saying. The land that gave us sufism is the land which has been torn apart by many wars over many years until this very day. This boggles my mind.
11. # JustMeon 20 Oct 2007 at 3:13 pm

    I think it’s one reason why I’m so nuts about little Shane. He’s not only wide open, he’s gentle. That is changing, now that he’s going to nursery school.. but still, I can just silently lay a cheek against his, and receive the same response. May he ever be gentle with others, and may he always need (and ask for) a kiss and a hug whenever he or another is leaving. In a culture of might, we have minimized the importance of gentleness, but other cultures don’t.
12. # JustMeon 20 Oct 2007 at 11:09 pm

    I’ve just sent you an email about that current spammer that keeps getting in..
13. # gabrielleon 21 Oct 2007 at 1:32 am

    I’m so glad you liked it, Pia. I was really taken with it too. Your comment made me think of the fact that even if we just look within our own Catholic tradition, we often find the mystics presenting their messages in times of great upheaval and turmoil, don’t we. God’s instruments.

    JustMe, I too hope that little Shane will keep his gentle ways, and I do believe he will. Thank you re the spammer – I’ve marked the comments as spam and deleted them – I’ll see what else I can do! But I also just received a lovely new comment on an old post – what a pleasant surprise!
14. # JustMeon 21 Oct 2007 at 8:44 am

    Both Shane’s parents are kind and gentle people, and quick to smile and easily lovable, so I too believe he’ll retain much of what he’s like right now, tho’ for sure he has gotten into boy-hollering and a bit of contrariness..

    Oh, I loved that new comment–and from a fellow Canadian! Whew, just to see the word “Trappist”.. I’ll bet there’s a section of Heaven with a sign above the alcove saying, “Step through here to see how the Trappists thought of Heaven.”
15. # marieon 23 Oct 2007 at 1:24 am

    A great mistake is made by many who while undergoing the ‘dark night’ or the ‘desert experience’ mistake this for God’s punishment.

    I take note of the Carmelites Teaching on disregarding our ‘feelings’ and instead Trust in God alone. God will never abandon us even if our ‘feelings’ say different.

    It is one of the reasons why I stayed within the Catholic Church(I have written about it on my own blog).

    Wonderful reflection Thankyou Gabrielle:)

    In Peace:)

    Marie
16. # gabrielleon 23 Oct 2007 at 8:03 am

    Hi, Marie! Yes, I remember reading at least one of your posts on the subject, around the time everyone was recently talking about Mother Teresa’s prolonged Dark Night, and appreciating your helping people to understand also the difference between true Dark Nights and depression.
17. # JustMeon 23 Oct 2007 at 11:15 am

    God calls us through depression as well, and by that I mean existential sadness, not clinical depression which has a physical base. I’ve found that following a depression down to its stinking dregs leaves us looking up, only. There’s nowhere else to look! And there, then, behold the One Who understands the seed of every tear, and there, then, behold the Remedy of the world.

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